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iScope Digital Media Has Built a New Online Lead Generation Platform and …

Posted on: Wednesday, 27 July 2011, 00:01 CDT

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For the original version on PRWeb visit: http://www.prweb.com/releases/prweb2011/7/prweb8668312.htm

Source: prweb

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Baidu CEO Discusses Q2 2011 Results – Earnings Call Transcript

Question-and-Answer Session

Operator

(Operator Instructions) Your first question comes from the line of Dick Wei of JPMorgan.

Dick Wei – JPMorgan

My first question is on the TAC revenue ratio. What is the reason for the slight decline in Q2 and what should be the trend going forward, because Jennifer mentioned it could increase? Just trying to understand the magnitude of the changes.

Jennifer Li

As I mentioned in the prepared remarks, the decrease reflects basically the traffic mix driven by especially strong organic traffic growth. It’s a very healthy trend and we’re happy to see this is a normal fluctuation as typically the traffic comes in the picture. I did mention that contextual ad business is an important initiative for us and we are making a lot of efforts on that front and developing Union partners to be part of the whole business.

The contextual ad business itself does require higher payout. So to the extent the business tracks very well, you should expect the traffic acquisition cost to increase as a percent of total revenue.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Jin Yoon with Nomura.

Jin Yoon – Nomura

You mentioned that you’re going to make some capital expenditures or capital investment into Qiyi. Can you talk about what monetary amount that you’re talking about and when that capital expenditure or investment will start? And secondly, you also mentioned that Qunar will be consolidated certainly in Q3 and you said it’s not that material. Can you identify what kind of revenue we should expect for the run rate for Qunar as well?

Jennifer Li

On the key investment, as we mentioned in our prepared remarks, is the important landing page strategy for us. Qiyi offers high-quality content and within a short time or period it’s tracking very well. Between Baidu and our investment partners, we plan to continue to support the company, and the cash contribution will be made in the near term.

As I mentioned, the cash contribution will flow through our PL line item, because we continue to account the investment in equity accounting methods. And because it’s still loss making, given the competitive media landscape, any investment we make that the venture generates, we will take our share of the loss through the PL line after the cash amount that we contribute.

As I indicated in the prepared remarks, we do not expect there will be material impact on the PL side as a result of the contribution to the Qiyi venture either in the third quarter or for the full year of 2011.

For your Qunar question, in our guidance we provided for Q3, we did incorporate the consolidated picture wheel as we provided the guidance. The vast majority of the strong Q3 guidance that we’re providing is driven by the strong fundamentals of Baidu’s core business, Qunar accounts for a very small amount. So it’s very immaterial in the overall revenue guidance as well as in the overall PL structure.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Catherine Leung with Goldman Sachs.

Catherine Leung – Goldman Sachs

Can you comment on whether Box Computing is creating any side benefits that are helping monetization indirectly, which is better traffic retention or advertisers’ spending is more visible on the social results page, understanding that you are not aggressively monetizing it directly at this stage?

Robin Li

I think you are very right. Box Computing is generating benefits both in terms of user experience or traffic retention as well as certain kind of revenue potential. You can basically view the Box Computing as a better way of displaying when thinking about revenue. It’s a better way of displaying ads, all kinds of different ways of displaying Box Computing results.

In most cases, it’s purely just a benefit for user. In some of the cases, it will benefit with the advertisers or customers too. So we will do these kinds of partnerships where we see fit going forward.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Eddie Leung with Bank of America-Merrill Lynch.

Eddie Leung – Bank of America-Merrill Lynch

I have a couple of questions. The first one is regarding your agreement with the major music label companies. Could you share with us if there will be any cost for music rights going forward? And if so, where will the cost items appear, whether it be in the cost of services or sales and marketing? Could you also give us the top advertiser segments for the second quarter?

Jennifer Li

As we have said in our press release, yes, we will be paying the record label companies some fee to incorporate their assets in our services. The amount itself is not significantly going to affect the cost of picture, and any fee that we are paying them will go through the operational cost line item as part of the cost of revenue. So it’s in the gross margin picture.

And in terms of your other question related to the top sectors for Q2, these mainly continue to be the typical ones, namely medical, machinery equipment, education, travel and business service. And all these five top sectors account a little over 50% of the total revenue picture.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Paul Wuh with Samsung Securities.

Paul Wuh – Samsung Securities

You mentioned the e-commerce and also the group buy advertising increasing. You didn’t mention those in the top five. What percentage of revenues would these two put together represent?

Jennifer Li

We have established a way of looking at our business and define the industry sectors. Because of the e-commerce business emerging at growing very fast, it just takes another angle and approach to look at our overall business. And when we look at e-commerce businesses, obviously that includes online purchases, whether it’s physical goods or services, things like travel, for example, if you look at Etrip, they are part of the travel vertical and they are also part of the e-commerce platform that provides online services.

So we have separately trapped the e-commerce contribution in the overall growth rate to give us a better understanding of the trends as we are in the fast-developing internet space. We have not separately disclosed the percentage per se, because it is just another angle to look at our industry sectors.

Having said that, we have mentioned quarter after quarters that we are seeing triple-digit growth in the e-commerce sector. That continues to be very strong, but it’s not a separate industry vertical that we’ll separately disclose.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Jiong Shao with Macquarie.

Jiong Shao – Macquarie

My question is on the margins. It looks like you did extremely well across the board for your margin profile this past quarter. It showed a significant deduction in terms of percentage of revenue for SGA, RD, et cetera. Just looking forward to an intermediate term, how should we look at your margin progression going forward in terms of further expansion from here?

Jennifer Li

We delivered very strong Q2 performance and record high margins. It is a very strong quarter for us. As I mentioned in my prepared remarks, aggressive investment will continue to be our priorities, particularly in the areas of RD, talent, network infrastructure and frankly office space as we need to accommodate more people. We are also investing very aggressively in the strategic partnership side.

If you look at our historical margin patterns, second half of the year is typically expense-heavy. RD expenses will be more heavily concentrated in the second half of the year. And if you look at near term, in Q3, we’ll have marketing events such as Baidu World. We’ll also re-double our efforts in campus brand building coming to the recruiting season. So expense will be particularly heavy in the second half of the year.

In addition to that, some of the strategic investments that we mentioned, these ventures do not generate very high margins. So in total, if you look at the Q2 and Q3 margin relationship of last year, that probably serves as a good reference.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Eric Wen with Mirae Asset.

Eric Wen – Mirae Asset Securities

Given that Baidu has just ended 150-city tour, and I remember that is bigger than last year’s 100-city tour, do you see a fast pickup of customer growth in the third quarter or toward the end of the second quarter?

Jennifer Li

Yes, we continued our market execution efforts this year. We have increased the coverage this year and run a very successful marketing campaign. As the industry leader, it’s our responsibility to really develop the market and educate the customers the benefit of search engine marketing.

From what we see, the campaigns are better run, because we have a lot to learn over our first try last year, and we’re very pleased with the results in terms of customer acceptance and their understanding of our services and using search engine marketing as very effective tool for them.

So on last line, we’re very happy with the marketing campaign that we conducted this year, and that really helped on customer acquisition as well.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Yu Jin with CICC.

Yu Jin – CICC

I have two brief questions. And one question is related to quarter guidance. In this industry and also in the country, we have very strong debate on the macro-economy. (inaudible) Did we see brand advertisers contributing amount (inaudible) to Baidu’s operations?

Robin Li

I think Baidu’s E-Series is relatively isolated from the manufacturer-oriented economy in provinces like (Jiyang). You can probably tell that larger customers contribute more and more of our revenue and mix and those customers typically reside in the tier-1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou and Shenzhen.

Service-oriented industries, especially group buy and others, are among our top five industries, education, medical or healthcare, those are very different from what you would see in the manufacturer-oriented industries in the provinces you mentioned. So I would say that our business is relatively isolated from that part of the macro-economy.

And I think more importantly, the pay search business is just too young, lots of growth opportunities for us. As long as we can execute well, we should be able to generate very good growth.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Philip Wan with Morgan Stanley.

Philip Wan – Morgan Stanley

You mentioned in your prepared remarks about the strong spending from large customers. Would you give us some more color about the differences between large and normal customers? Also, you’d be very helpful if you could comment on the revenue contribution from large customers.

Jennifer Li

We really cover a very diverse pool of customers, and the customers’ spending level can vary a lot. When we look at our large businesses, some of these customers spend tens of millions a year. And some of the SMEs can be of a very long-tail services, and thereby keywords and spend along maybe a few hundred euros, a few thousand of RMB per year.

So we do have a very wide spectrum in terms of customers spending. But having said that, what we have said over the past few quarters is we continue to see strong spending from the large customers. They are particularly good at using the search engine marketing tools, and they see the kind of ROIs that can be generated from the Baidu platform. And therefore, they are spending more and more with us. And the contribution from large businesses continued to grow very strongly over the past quarter. It exceeded the SME business.

But having said that, the SME continues to be the pretty vast majority of the revenue contribution. But we’re particularly happy with the large customer adoption of our business platform and their contribution to our overall revenue picture.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Steve Weinstein with Pacific Crest.

Steve Weinstein – Pacific Crest

Another question just on the growth in advertisers. I was a little surprised that the growth in advertisers in terms of year-over-year percentage and year-over-year absolute percentage of new advertisers was already slowing down. Can you talk about where your priorities are as a company in terms of targeting larger advertisers versus building out more mass within the SMEs? And the different initiatives there should help us frame how we should be thinking about growth over the next few quarters or into the next year. And could we ask to just get the headcount for the quarter and number of salespeople?

Robin Li

When we transformed from the legendary system to Phoenix Nest, the system became much more complicated, and it did enable large advertisers or customers to do more. And coupled with the maturity of that market, large companies increasingly realized that they can benefit from search marketing. So we were very busy serving lots of large customers.

The vast majority of SMEs, it just takes them longer to get used to this new system and fully take advantage of all the functions and features of our system. Going forward, we are continuing to improve the customer experience online and do more hand coding for our smaller customers.

But at the end of the day, we’re all focused on what will benefit the company most in terms of revenue generation and profit, all that and other things.

Jennifer Li

To continue to add to Robin’s point, we are doing a lot more to help the customers better use our platform. The customer base grew at a healthy rate of 17% year-on-year, and we are enhancing our sales and customer services and the educational process to help SMEs to master the features of online marketing platform.

As we mentioned in our prepared remarks, we upgraded our front-end interface, making it easier for the customers, particularly the SMEs, and to make the whole process for decision-making and maneuvering down to five steps instead of the original 15. So we are doing all kinds of things to try to make the sophisticated system more user-friendly.

And even market potential continues to be huge, and we are doing our efforts, as we mentioned, in developing the market at the same time we are redoubling our efforts to better serve the customers. But as Robin mentioned, it generally takes a few quarters for the customers to really take advantage of the better system and more streamlined process that they can see.

In terms of your second question, the number of salespeople at the end of Q2 was 6,300.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Cynthia Meng with Jeffries.

Cynthia Meng – Jeffries

I have two questions. Number one, Baidu has already introduced Baidu browser. Can you share with us the overall strategy regarding client-side software and desktop applications on both the PC side and mobile side? And any details regarding future product development roadmap would be very helpful.

Second question is regarding Box Computing. We would like to know some more details with respect to the coverage, the percent of queries that are covered by Box Computing. Management mentioned some time ago, it was 50% before. I would like to know what is the percentage right now.

Robin Li

On the client-side software, we do think browser is a very important distribution channel for our business. In China, the browser market is relatively fragmented. People have developed a habit of installing their preferred browser on their desktops. So we are trying to meet that part of the user need.

Once a user installs a browser controlled by us, then we’ll able to generate more search traffic. This is true both on the PC side and also on the mobile side. On the mobile side, we also have a mobile browser for our users. In general, we just view the client-side software as a way of distributing Baidu services.

Most people are still used to total Baidu website and do their things. But there are certain percentages of users, maybe 10% or less, they have developed a habit of using client-side software to do all kind of things. And we just view that as distribution. And sometimes, we’ll do it ourselves, developing our own client-side software. Sometimes, we’ll just partner with those client-side software developers and share revenue with them.

On the Box Computing, coverage right now is roughly 70%. 70% of the search result pages contain Box Computing results.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Mayuresh Masurekar with Collins Stewart.

Mayuresh Masurekar – Collins Stewart

Could you talk about revenue contribution this quarter from your initiatives other than core search like contextual, online video, e-commerce and so on. And also, what you have assumed for them in the third quarter guidance and how big you expect it to be for 2012 and beyond?

Jennifer Li

Other revenue contribution in terms of contextual and online display ads, in comparison, they (inaudible) in comparison to our main core business, which is page search. They are, as I mentioned, an important area for us to grow future revenue possibilities. They’re growing at a faster speed. Although it’s a smaller base, but they’re going at a faster speed and it’s tracking, it’s picking good traction in terms of growth projection, the speed of growth.

The overall contribution from these lines is very small of the total picture. But as I mentioned, they are going faster and over time they’ll become meaningful.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Gene Munster with Piper Jaffray.

Gene Munster – Piper Jaffray

That’s an impressive revenue growth and I guess on that note, in terms of the overall search can you continue to drive the ARPU higher? And if so I guess what changes in the future do you see is a platform? I guess you don’t call Phoenix anymore, but to the platform that you can make in the next year to continue this high-double digit growth?

Robin Li

What we have seen or heard from our customers, especially the larger ones, there is due allocations and majority of the budget to offline advertising, while the ROI for the components for our online advertising, especially search, is much better. So we do expect this kind of trend will continue. So the ARPU should continue to grow.

Internally we do see a lot of room for improvement, both in terms of the bidding mechanism as well as tools to help advertiser to better manage their advertising campaign. There are lots of lots of things we can do. And again that the market is in its early stage, we do expect a significant growth going forward.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Wendy Huang with RBS Scotland.

Wendy Huang – RBS Scotland

Number one, it’s seems that every Q2 your ARPU is very strong growth. Is it a part being driven by the seasonally? And should we apply this to the future years as well? And secondly, apart from online video, travel and recruitment where you have already made significant investment and progress, what will be the next vertical or you plan to make the investment in?

Jennifer Li

A strong Q2 ARPU performance, there is a strong element of seasonality. Typically, Q1 is a slower season, because of the Chinese New Year. And you will see a big sequential increase in the second quarter from total revenue standpoint. And total revenue contribution typically of course comes from both the ARPU growth as well as the numbers of customers’ growth.

Both metrics will continue to have a lot of potential going forward. So you know as seasonal pattern would tell us that we should continue to see strong ARPU as well as some step-up in terms of the customer growth in future.

In terms of the strong verticals, yes, those vertical that you mentioned, we have established either a partnership or investment in those areas. We have as we mentioned also in the real estate area formed a partnership to help deliver better user experience, overall user experience. Importantly, these are important vertical areas, things like OTL, we’ll continue develop and financial services we’ll continue develop.

So there are in our landing page a strategy, it helps to cover the strong and important verticals. And our objective is to form a strong partnership, working with others in different form and deliver a high quality user service experience.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Wallace Cheung with Credit Suisse.

Wallace Cheung – Credit Suisse

A question mainly on your mobile phone strategies, there is some news report saying Baidu is the Philippine-owned operating systems on a mobile side as well as the mobile phone. So can you elaborate more about the strategies in terms of like potential timeline of the launch?

Robin Li

We do see a lot of opportunities for the Smartphone industry, as adoption continue to grow fast. We are developing a number of mobile phone related services and systems. As they become ready we will announce that. Before that, we are not going to disclose our plans.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Muzhi Li with Mizuho Securities.

Muzhi Li – Mizuho Securities

Jennifer, would you clearly give me more clarity on the definition of large customers like do you define them by the size of their spendings or their size of their revenues, et cetera? Thank you very much.

Jennifer Li

Large customers in our definition, they typically have a more comprehensive request when it comes to marketing and promotional efforts. And these players typically have a brand that they want to build and continue to enhance. So typically, if you name them, they are maybe a thousand of these large customers in the country and these are branded advertisers.

And as I mentioned, their service requirement is what will be more comprehensive. And their service needs is more sophisticated from both, their all perspective and requirement on the advertising platform.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Andy Lee with Standard Chartered Bank.

Unidentified Analyst

This is actually Ron here. I just have a quick question. Can you give a little bit more color on your overseas plan? Are you all planning to setup offices maybe in Chinese-dominated countries, for example?

Robin Li

Like I mentioned before, we are going to expand into many other markets for the years to come. We are internally developing a better infrastructure that will support much more languages and when it’s ready, we’ll be able to launch much more languages simultaneously. And around that time, we’ll be able to setup overseas offices. But right now, we are not ready to say, which country we are going into and how aggressive we will become.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of (inaudible).

Unidentified Analyst

I have one question. Regarding the site Hou123? I want to know how much of the traffic contribution from Hao123? And how much revenue contribution from 123, if it possible?

Jennifer Li

Hao123 has been around for a number of years. There’s a very well known directory side and brand name. It does contribute some level of monetization. It’s a integral part of our overall service. We have not separately disclosed the traffic or the amount of revenue contributor from the side. But as I mentioned, it’s an overall offering that we provide to the marketplace as well as to our advertisers.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Andy Yeung with Oppenheimer.

Andy Yeung – Oppenheimer

My question is about your view on vertical search market. Some of your investment in parts such as (inaudible) and the auto, all have some vertical basic in them. So can you give us some insight into your view on the vertical search market? And how does that play into your future investment and product strategy.

Robin Li

We do see value in the vertical search areas. That’s why we make partnerships and investments in a number of companies in this sector. The value is typically they can customize a lot of data. For example, for Click, they have a lot of realtor data in the second-hand homes or those kinds of information that’s more structured in the database.

In the case of Qunar, we have a very large database of hotels. And we work with that can provide up-to-date information such as price per room night, those kind of information. We would like to tightly integrate this kind of information in our search results, so that our users are better served.

And on the other hand, because of the re-enhancement or the value of those vertical search players can add to this kind of data, they deserve to make money from this very important verticals. So we’d like to have certain kind of positioning in those leading companies to ensure that we do not lose the good user experience they decide not to work with us in the future. So this kind of investments or partnerships are win-win and it hardly brings any fair value. And at the end of day it’s better for our users.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Gary Ngan with UBS.

Gary Ngan – UBS

I have two questions, the first one is, just now Jennifer you mentioned that there is about a thousand launch customers in the country. So could you comment a little bit more kind of roughly the coverage ratio that Baidu has already established relationships with? And my second question is related to what Robin just now mentioned about Baidu’s interest in the social search or social related businesses.

So in your view, do you think that this social network i.e., Weibo and Facebook like type of SNS today in china are the long-terms mode of social networks or Baidu is thinking about some other really innovative and completely landscape shaking SNS mode in the future?

Jennifer Li

Hi Gary, I’ll take your first part of the question. About a thousand large customers, these as I mentioned are the branded advertisers. And they typically, you know these are the large customers that basically all the advertising media platform will approach. And they will take advantage of those marketing platforms.

So we are probably not much different from a customer per say as compared to other media platforms. This is more a matter of budget allocation. So historically these players will spend a lot more on the traditional media side. And with the internet and particularly search engine, we offer targeted performance based marketing platform. And we offer a full bundle of set of services to these and they are increasingly allocating more add budgets to our platform.

Robin Li

On the social front, our case is basically in brief and extent. We have added a lot of social features in our existing products, such as that app feature and the share features. We also have feed in some our products like a PostBar. We think in the future there are a lot of things we can do, starting from Qunar core offering, web search or search-related.

We would like to perfectly combine the people relationship with content relationship. In some cases, users are looking for contenting, in some other cases users are looking for relationships. We’d like to perfectly combine this tool and give user a home that they depend on. So we are indeed working on some new products that will better satisfy users need. In China there is no dominant SNS in this market. That give us a very good opportunity to innovate and lead leading markets like this.

Operator

You have a follow-up from the line of Eric Wen with Mirae Asset.

Eric Wen – Mirae Asset Securities

Robin my question is, how far is Baidu towards monetizing its Map product? And given the strengths of showing group buying companies, how much of those advertising are being integrated with Baidu’s mapped product?

Robin Li

Right now, the revenue from Map product is very insignificant, and we do not expect that to change in the near future. But Map is strategically important to Baidu, especially in the age of wireless internet or mobile internet. I’m not sure if we generated revenue from the group buying companies on the Map service, but it’s not important.

We’ve worked now to better Map service continuously so that people can find better local information, people can get connected to nearby people who share similar interests or who know each other. So Map is not a revenue generator. It’s not going to be in the near future, but it’s very critical in our overall net service bandwidth.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Hui Dong with HSBC.

Hui Dong – HSBC

I have a quick question for Robin. I think China e-commerce online advertising spending story has been with us for some time. When do you think this segment growth will pick and start to slow down?

Robin Li

I think China’s e-commerce market is in its early stage. It took off much later than search. That’s not the case in the U.S., as you know. These days, a lot of companies get funded, traditional companies, brick-and-mortar companies starting to increase the e-commerce trend. And more importantly, consumers are developing a habit of buying online.

So we see tremendous momentum going forward, and more and more companies well realize that the best way to do e-commerce is through Baidu. So we’ll continue to benefit from this trend for the years to come.

Operator

We are now approaching the end of the conference call. I would now like to turn the conference over to Baidu’s Chief Executive Officer, Robin Li, for his closing remarks.

Robin Li

Well, once again, thank you for joining us today. And please do not hesitate to contact us if you have any further questions.

Operator

Thank you for your participation in today’s conference. This concludes the presentation. You may now disconnect. Good day.

In-Call Ads The Future for Skype?

Skype has plans to monetize from those who do not pay for the service, and for good reason. People use Skype for several minutes if not hours per day, and for the most part those calls are free. It’s unclear how future ads within Skype will roll out. However, Tony Bates shared some information that might make you question the company’s future decision(s).

Back in March Skype rolled out displays ads on it’s home page, but has not placed them anywhere else. Bates said in an interview, “The one I want to tease right now is in-call advertising. The average length of a video call is going up — it’s about 27 minutes now — and you’re doing a lot of things in that time. If we’re talking, you’re not just looking at me, so we have a lot of opportunities there.”

Bates has confirmed that the company is holding off until the Skype-Microsoft deal is finalized — so now we play the waiting game. Ads could show up in the form of audio, video, and images, but it looks like we’ll have to wait a little longer to find out. Just know, Skype is considering in-call advertising. Something I know many people will be upset about. I guess you can always pay if you don’t like the ads. Although that said, I’d switch to Google Talk if the audio quality was better.

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Printer Defies Deripaska Over Lease

Senatorov says the factory met his demands with a declaration of war.

Senatorov says the factory met his demands with a declaration of war.


Mikhail Senatorov has printed catalogs for carmaker Audi and advertising agency BBDO and campaign posters for United Russia. The Office of Presidential Affairs gave his company its Printer of the Year award.

But these days Senatorov produces a steady flow of letters to law enforcement officials and executives at Basic Element, a company controlled by billionaire Oleg Deripaska.

His company, Offset Print House 21, is mired in a dispute with Basic Element, which owns the Tryokhgornaya textile factory where he leases his premises, and he fears that he’s going to get kicked out.

“We live like we’re in a fortress under siege,” said Senatorov, general director of Offset Print House 21, which he opened with business partner Nikolai Yelagin in 2001, a year before the textile factory was purchased by Basic Element Group.

Disputes between business owners and landlords are nothing new. But what makes this unique is that few small business owners have dared to challenge a billionaire as powerful as Deripaska.

Basic Element said its plans for the factory, portions of which were built in the 18th century, are to facilitate textile manufacturing. But some observers suspect that it wants to develop a luxury office center in the factory on 15 Rochdelskaya Ulitsa, near the White House.

“The redevelopment of the place would be quite lucrative because many companies are interested in having a prestigious address near Kutuzovsky Prospekt,” said Anastasia Uspenskaya, a consultant with the Jones Lang LaSalle real estate agency.

Senatorov’s printing plant, which he built from scratch inside the old brick factory, is in jeopardy. The factory management, he said, wants to remove his business, with an annual turnover of $3 million to $4 million and 85 employees, from its premises.

The reason? The Deripaska-owned company is not satisfied with the rent Senatorov pays: $45 per square meter per year for a space of 1,400 square meters. Jones Lang LaSalle estimates that the market value for a lease for renovated premises on the site ranges from $8,000 to $16,000 per square meter.

While the lease amount might sound laughable for premises located near the White House and World Trade Center, the price in the contract, which runs through 2016, is not subject to renegotiation.

Senatorov acknowledged that the price might be low, but he noted that in addition to the printing plant, he has signed contracts to rent three areas of the factory for $220 to $360 per square meter annually. “That makes it a medium rental price on the market,” Senatorov said.

The factory has terminated the agreements for the three areas, with the last being severed in June, and the printer’s main building is now the only facility left.

Senatorov and his business partner said they were willing to move to another location but they want $2 million in compensation for the money they spent renovating and equipping what was an abandoned factory building when they moved in.

Senatorov said the building had been used for dying fabric, and nothing more than walls and the roof were in place when he arrived. Even the floor had to be replaced because of damage from the acid dyes.

“They told me they have no premises within the factory, and that was all,” he said.

However, Tryokhgornaya spokeswoman Tatyana Yamshchikova said the factory offered Senatorov a chance to relocate after city officials gave a special historical status to the building he occupies.

“But the company management tried to take advantage of the situation by demanding compensation that is 3 1/2 times greater than the sum received from the print house over the 10 years of the lease,” Yamshchikova said.

Senatorov said the factory met his demands with a declaration of war. In February, the factory prohibited the printer’s trucks and clients’ cars from entering its territory, demanding that he pay 150 rubles ($5) every time a car enters and 6,000 rubles ($200) for a monthly pass for one car. “It was done without any explanation. They have chosen to terrorize us,” Senatorov said.

He said he has paid almost 94,000 rubles ($3,000) for single-car passes for visitors over four months.

In May, Senatorov said, the factory cut his phone and Internet cables, forcing him to use his cell phone for business communications and to switch to more expensive wireless Internet. He said he believes that phone operator West Call cut the lines under pressure from the factory and that no one else’s cables were cut on the premises.

West Call representatives had no immediate comment on the claim.

Senatorov said he has filed complaints about the factory with the prosecutor’s office and Federal Anti-Monopoly Service and even wrote a letter to Prime Minister Vladimir Putin, whose United Russia party was among his clients.

Senatorov in January was named Printer of the Year by the Office of Presidential Affairs for his work with government agencies.

This month, the Presnensky District Prosecutor’s Office sent him a letter saying that an additional investigation would be made in the case, Senatorov said.

Incidentally, Tryokhgornaya textile workers also tried to attract the attention of Putin and his All-Russia People’s Front in late May, rallying against management plans to slash the work force and relocate the factory to Gavrilov-Yam, a depressed town in the Yaroslavl region that is also home to another textile factory owned by Basic Element.

The protesters were supported by the Russian Textile Union, which sent a letter to the Prosecutor General’s Office asking it to look into the situation.

This is not the first time that Deripaska, whose fortune is estimated at more than $16 billion by Forbes magazine, has been embroiled in a labor dispute. In 2009, Putin personally intervened after workers at a Basic Element-owned cement plant in the Leningrad region town of Pikalyovo blocked a major road demanding payment after the plant ceased operations due to high prices charged by local raw-material suppliers.

A spokesman for Deripaska’s Basic Element referred all questions to Tryokhgornaya.

Tryokhgornaya spokeswoman Yamshchikova said her company is “engaged in a continuing dialogue with the printer to reconsider the lease agreement.” She called the 2001 lease agreement “enslavement” and said the factory doesn’t rule out the possibility of going to court.

“We are amazed that the printer is making a business conflict public. That is called pressure,” Yamshchikova said.

Senatorov said he doubts that the factory will go to court. “This situation did not start yesterday,” he said. “They could have filed a lawsuit against us many times if they had a legal basis.”

Law firm’s strategies in mortgage holders’ struggles provoke ethics issues

By Kris Hundley, Times Staff Writer

In Print: Monday, July 25, 2011



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David E. Ramba is a Tallahassee lobbyist and lawyer who has prospered representing well-heeled clients such as ATT, the Seminole Tribe and the Florida Chiropractic Association. But these days, he flies his six-seat Piper Malibu around Florida championing the cause of the little guy.

His target: the big, bad banks.

Ramba, 40, has joined forces with a California attorney and opened offices in Pinellas Park and Boca Raton where employees ask struggling homeowners to join an innovative legal action against their lenders.

Prospective plaintiffs are told that nearly 6,000 people have joined the effort and six lawsuits have been filed so far.

But there are several hitches.

It costs $5,000 to join. Winning a quick settlement is a long shot. Efforts to solicit plaintiffs through cold calls, unapproved mail pieces and commissioned workers also may violate Florida Bar rules, according to experts in legal ethics.

Regulators in California and Washington state warn that legal actions like Ramba’s are just the latest twist on mortgage relief schemes that charged up-front fees for loan modifications that didn’t happen. Federal and many state laws now ban such fees in most cases.

In March, the California Department of Real Estate warned about mortgage relief lawsuits.

“Those who continue to prey on and victimize vulnerable homeowners have not given up,” it said. “They just change their tactics and modify their sales pitches to keep taking advantage of those who are desperate to save their homes.”

• • •

Ramba’s West Coast colleague, lawyer Philip A. Kramer, has already been criticized for promising to negotiate loan modifications that never materialized. The Los Angeles Better Business Bureau gave him an “F” based on 45 consumer complaints.

A lawyer in Kramer’s firm said it was the banks’ fault, not the firm’s, that modification efforts failed. Neither Kramer nor Ramba has any record of disciplinary actions.

Ground zero in Florida for the new legal assault on the banks is a mostly vacant office complex connected to a Winn-Dixie shopping plaza off 66th Street N.

The gold lettering on the door says Ramba Law Group and Kramer Kaslow. But instead of starched-shirt lawyers in plush offices inside, there are rows of cubicles. Casually dressed workers are hunched over phones. Their goal: tap into homeowners’ anger at the banks and get them to part with some cash.

Ramba makes no apologies for requiring a retainer to put someone’s name on a lawsuit.

“The legal system is available to folks, but it’s not free,” he said in a recent phone interview. “By coming together, homeowners will receive the same benefit someone with a lot of means could do on their own.”

Davin Spring, who has a wife, three kids and a barely profitable business in Baton Rouge, La., was sold on the concept. Spring is current on his mortgage, but owes more than his home is worth. When Spring tried to get some relief from his lender, he only got a runaround.

So when he got a direct-mail advertisement about a big lawsuit that could force banks to lower homeowners’ interest, reduce their debt or maybe even wipe out their mortgages, it caught Spring’s attention. He called and reached a representative of Ramba’s in Pinellas Park.

“They told me they only had two more spaces,” Spring said. “They got me hook, line and sinker.”

• • •

It is Kramer, of Calabasas, Calif., who claims credit for the idea of suing the banks after efforts at loan modifications failed. The only way to approach uncooperative lenders, Kramer decided, was to file “mass joinder” lawsuits in the names of thousands of people facing the same obstacles.

“We go in with a club and make demands on the bank,” Kramer said in a video on the site of Consolidated Litigation Group, an affiliated company.

“We’re tired of answering questions and resubmitting pay stubs. It’s time for the banks to begin answering our questions.”

Since December, Kramer has filed lawsuits in California courts against Bank of America, Citibank, Chase, Wells Fargo, One West and Ally Bank. The complaints have different plaintiffs, but are nearly identical in the allegations, charging lenders with “massive fraud” that “devastated the values of their residences, in most cases resulting in the plaintiffs’ loss of all or substantially all of their net worth.”

None of the complaints has yet gone to trial or been settled, and neither Kramer nor Ramba could cite mass joinder cases that have been successful against banks.

While Kramer’s mass joinder strategy is similar to class-action lawsuits, there are a few differences. In class-action cases, the plaintiffs are treated as a single entity and get an equal share of any settlement. Lawyers usually forego an up-front retainer in return for a contingency fee that can range from 30 to 50 percent.

In mass joinder lawsuits, the cases are combined for discovery purposes. But individual plaintiff’s circumstances are unique and any settlement is divvied up based on the facts of each case.

Plaintiffs’ lawyers get a share of the proceeds; Kramer and Ramba’s contracts call for a 30 percent contingency in addition to the retainer of up to $5,000 per client.

Charles Rose, a professor at Stetson University College of Law, said he doesn’t doubt borrowers could have valid claims against banks. But he questions whether a lawyer can appropriately represent the conflicting interests of thousands of plaintiffs. And he suspects banks will put up a strong defense.

“I would be surprised if the banks roll over on these cases,” Rose said. “Because once they settle, it opens the floodgates to other cases. “

Kramer, named a “Southern California Super Lawyer” by his peers, said banks will want to avoid a trial and might agree to a settlement as early as next year. Ramba, who said he intends to file additional cases in Florida by October, agreed that a 2012 settlement is possible.

“If you determine there’s a pattern and practice of loan origination that violates federal law and they profited by that, they’re required to disgorge those profits,” Ramba said. “All we need is a fact-finding mission determining who was practicing adverse banking laws.”

• • •

Such tough talk has resonated with clients. Philip Warmanen of Jacksonville is a plaintiff in the California complaint against the Bank of America. Warmanen, a 71-year-old travel agent, responded to a direct-mail piece from Kramer’s firm this year and signed on when the retainer was $4,000. He said he’s current with his first and second mortgages, but his home is worth half of what it was when he bought it in 2006. Warmanen thinks his lender, Bank of America, should share in the loss.

While Warmanen was told by Kramer’s office that his mortgage might be eliminated as a result of the lawsuit, he would be happy with a cash settlement that could reduce his debt.

“I may have gambled $4,000 for nothing,” Warmanen said of Kramer’s retainer. “But Bank of America is a giant without a heart.”

A spokeswoman for Bank of America, Christina Beyer, said the mass joinder lawsuit is “without merit.”

In response to Warmanen’s complaints, she said, “The bank is committed to helping borrowers in distress with loan modifications and other loss mitigation alternatives.”

Even without a settlement or court victory, Kramer has collected a substantial amount in retainer fees so far from the 2,500 plaintiffs named in the California lawsuits. If each paid $4,000 as Warmanen did, it would total $10 million.

Colin Sandland of Bradenton talked with a representative of Ramba’s Pinellas Park office in June after getting an ad in the mail. While Sandland, who is current on his mortgage, was intrigued at the thought of holding banks accountable, he didn’t like the demand for cash up front.

Sandland, 65, said he asked Ramba’s representative what happened to the retainer. “He said, ‘We’re on commission,’ ” Sandland said. “Why would I pay $5,000 to a lawyer who’s going to get 30 percent of any settlement? That turned me off.”

• • •

Experts on legal ethics say the way Ramba’s office solicits plaintiffs could be problematic. Cold calls are banned by Florida Bar rules, whether they’re made by lawyers or someone working on their behalf. This is the case even if the solicitation is made using information from public records, as Ramba said his office does.

“It’s the oldest problem in the book ethically,” said Amy Mashburn, a law professor at the University of Florida. “The idea is how do you protect people from in-person pressure from people skilled in the art of persuasion. A letter will not put people under the same kind of pressure as a lawyer or their representative at the foot of a hospital bed.”

Likewise, any direct-mail piece sent by a lawyer must be reviewed by the Florida Bar. Though Ramba said his mailer conforms with the group’s advertising guidelines, a spokeswoman for the Bar said she does not have any record that he submitted it for review.

On Friday, Ramba said in an e-mail that no mailers have yet been sent by the Pinellas Park office. “The office manager down in your area informed me that they HAD NOT sent anything out with my information on it,” he said.

He did not respond to an e-mail asking how Spring and Sandland would have known to call that office if they had not received mailers with the phone number on it.

Florida Bar rules also say it’s unethical for lawyers to split fees with nonlawyers by paying commissions tied to retainers. A recent “help wanted” ad for Ramba’s Pinellas Park office promised “$1,000 to $5,000/wk Potential.”

Rose, the Stetson professor, said if nonlawyers are paid a commission based on how many clients sign up, “they may have a vested interest in skirting the boundaries of ethical rules.”

“That’s giving nonlawyers an interest in the outcome of litigation and that’s not allowed,” he said.

Ramba declined to disclose exactly how his call center workers are paid, but said, “It’s not fee-splitting.”

• • •

Spring, the small business owner from Baton Rouge, La., gave Ramba’s group $2,500 before having second thoughts and stopping payment on the rest of his retainer. Now, he’s kicking himself for falling for a pitch that seemed to offer a way out of his mortgage mess.

“When I needed help, I reached out,” said Spring, who has been unable to get a refund. “Unfortunately, I got the wrong hand.”

Times researcher Natalie Watson contributed to this report. Kris Hundley can be reached at khundley@sptimes.com or (727)892-2996.

Go to links.tampabay.com

• Watch videos of attorney Philip A. Kramer discussing mass joinder litigation against the banks.

• See a sample retainer contract for Ramba Law Group’s mass joinder lawsuits.

• See a direct mail ad sent by Kramer’s office, soliciting clients for mass joinder actions.

[Last modified: Jul 25, 2011 07:13 AM]


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